A Tea between friends :-) How was Your Day

[nallath]

Is the bed leveling they use so new and unseen? Didn't know that.

Not so much the bed leveling, but the method used for the bed leveling.

[nallath]

I don't know. I figured all of these players who prided themselves for being open source would eventually find a way to rationalize their needs for patents. I'm not saying I feel it is good, nor bad.

But an industry that exploded into existence thanks to expiring patents...just seems ironic.

As I've posted before, as far as I'm concerned patents should be abolished. But the reality is that they are here (and here to stay), so you need do something with it. I used to be responsible for most of the IP stuff at Ultimaker and I advised UM to get the patents (See the contradiction there?)

I posted a pretty long post on the UM forum that explains that rationale. Feel free to ask questions about this.

I can't assure this enough, so I will do so again; This does not mean by any way that ultimaker is going closed source.

[reibuehl]

Is the bed leveling they use so new and unseen? Didn't know that.

Not so much the bed leveling, but the method used for the bed leveling.

Then I think I haven't understood the method - the legalese that they use in the patent is hard for me as a non-native English speaker...

I thought that they just do with their core lifting mechanism what everybody else that does software leveling does with the Z-axis. And that didn't sound like the big invention to me as it would be in the end again just a movement in the Z direction.

[LePaul]

Aww why make me go there (where it's so slooow to load and find stuff) to read your view?

[nallath]

Aww why make me go there (where it's so slooow to load and find stuff) to read your view?

Sorry. Read the post there first, so thats where I wrote my piece.

[jonnybischof]

What do you guys think of this?
https://ultimaker.com/en/community/3912 ... rst-patent?

Well, I think Ultimaker would be eaten by the sharks soon (as soon as their market share shows up in the big statistics) if they wouldn't go that way. I don't know if that one patent is enough to protect the Ultimaker 3 from being killed off by patent lawsuits, but doing nothing would be irresponsible - not only towards their company (which consists of people who need their jobs) but also to their users which bought expensive machines and rely on Ultimaker being around in the future to supply them with spare parts and materials.

I think everyone agrees that patents are a work of the devil, but that doesn't mean we can ignore them and pretend they don't pose a threat to a company like Ultimaker which becomes more and more important in an industry that - frankly - hasn't moved much in many years but are used to selling their stuff with insanely bad price / value ratio (just look at professional ABS filament cartridges, holy moly....).

So, yeah, this sucks. But did you really think it would never come to it? At least Ultimaker promises not to enforce their patents against their users and inventors - which is better than just filing a patent and acting like it's none of our business!

[nallath]

Well, I think Ultimaker would be eaten by the sharks soon (as soon as their market share shows up in the big statistics) if they wouldn't go that way.

Also note that you can backdate a patent lawsuit. It's actually a strategy to ignore a patent infringement for 19(!!) years and then suddenly show up and demand 19 years of royalty fees. So waiting for "the little piglet" to get nice & fat before taking it to the slaughter is really something that is done.

One patent won't protect, but this is just the first patent to become public. As can be seen in the blog post, this isn't the only one that's still in the pipeline (which is also one of my peeves with patents; it takes 1.5 years(!!!) for them to become public!)

[Neotko]

So, hopefully UM doesn't end bought by someone along 19years and then he chooses to sue everyone and his mother

Well, I understand UM point. But also clearly shows that CC don't protect a thing.

[nallath]

Well, I understand UM point. But also clearly shows that CC don't protect a thing.

It's very good at protecting art (drawings & designs). It's just being misused for other things. It's a bit like blaming a screwdriver for not being good at ensuring that a nail gets in the wood.

[LePaul]

It seems like a very 'slippery slope' as we call it here.

I certainly don't fault Ultimaker for doing it. I have the same feeling as others ...it sucks they've had to.

[Neotko]

Well, I understand UM point. But also clearly shows that CC don't protect a thing.

It's very good at protecting art (drawings & designs). It's just being misused for other things. It's a bit like blaming a screwdriver for not being good at ensuring that a nail gets in the wood.

Sure. Everyone is happy until the music is off.

I think the best idea is the one from Meduza, that's really a nail on the wood.

https://ultimaker.com/en/community/3912 ... ply-173465

Anyhow, I prefer the BCN3D approach. They share not just what they do, but how they do it. But ofc, they are a non profit company, so they are really focus on teaching.

[nallath]

Anyhow, I prefer the BCN3D approach. They share not just what they do, but how they do it. But ofc, they are a non profit company, so they are really focus on teaching.

It also doesn't prevent lawsuits, it only makes winning them easier if it ever gets to it.

[LePaul]

Interesting response blog...

http://www.tridimake.com/2017/03/ultima ... lshit.html

[nallath]

I've typed a very long and maybe a bit frustrated reply to his blog. He has a bit of a naive look on patents & IP.

[LePaul]

I suspect, for a lot of old timers....there is concern we are seeing what happened with Makerbot all over again.

I think Ultimaker is much smarter than that.